Picking the different solutions to the time independent Schrodinger eqaution The Next CEO of Stack OverflowSolving the time independent Schrodinger equation: Does a complex solution make sense?How does a complex wavefunction “hold” energy?Change of variable in harmonic oscillator time independent Schrodinger equationQuantum mechanics in electric fieldConstructing solutions to the time-dependent Schrödinger's equationProtocol for solving time independent Schrodinger equationScaling the Time Independent Schrodinger EquationMomentum in time independent schrodinger equationOn Griffith Quantum example 2.1: normalization of wave function in time.1D Time independent Schrodinger eq. with limit

Why did we only see the N-1 starfighters in one film?

At which OSI layer a user-generated data resides?

Why does the UK parliament need a vote on the political declaration?

BOOM! All Clear for Mr. T

How do you know when two objects are so called entangled?

How do we know the LHC results are robust?

Clustering points and summing up attributes per cluster in QGIS

What happens if you roll doubles 3 times then land on "Go to jail?"

Reduce array of object to totals by property object

If/When UK leaves the EU, can a future goverment do a referendum to join EU

Trouble understanding the speech of overseas colleagues

Can a caster that cast Polymorph on themselves stop concentrating at any point even if their Int is low?

Science fiction short story involving a paper written by a schizophrenic

What can we do to stop prior company from asking us questions?

Monthly twice production release for my software project

Is it ever safe to open a suspicious html file (e.g. email attachment)?

Is HostGator storing my password in plaintext?

If Nick Fury and Coulson already knew about aliens (Kree and Skrull) why did they wait until Thor's appearance to start making weapons?

What's the best way to handle refactoring a big file?

Opposite of a diet

Hindi speaking tourist to UK from India

How should I support this large drywall patch?

What benefits would be gained by using human laborers instead of drones in deep sea mining?

Customer Requests (Sometimes) Drive Me Bonkers!



Picking the different solutions to the time independent Schrodinger eqaution



The Next CEO of Stack OverflowSolving the time independent Schrodinger equation: Does a complex solution make sense?How does a complex wavefunction “hold” energy?Change of variable in harmonic oscillator time independent Schrodinger equationQuantum mechanics in electric fieldConstructing solutions to the time-dependent Schrödinger's equationProtocol for solving time independent Schrodinger equationScaling the Time Independent Schrodinger EquationMomentum in time independent schrodinger equationOn Griffith Quantum example 2.1: normalization of wave function in time.1D Time independent Schrodinger eq. with limit










2












$begingroup$


The time independent Schrodinger equation
$$-frachbar^22m fracd^2psidx^2+Vpsi = Epsi$$ can have many different solutions of $psi$ for a particular value of $E$.



For example, if we found a complex solution $psi(x)$ for a particular value of $E$, say $E_0$, we can write $psi(x)=a(x)+ib(x)$. Then $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ will also be solutions to the T.I.S.E with $E=E_0$. Furthermore $c_1a(x)+c_2b(x)$ will also be solutions with $c_1$ and $c_2$ being arbitrary constants.



I read that one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$. But does that mean all these different solutions represent the same physical state of a particle?



The expectation value of any dynamical variable $Q(x,p)$ is given by
$int psi^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)psi. $ How do we know for sure that $int a(x)^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)a(x) $ and $int b(x)^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)b(x)$ gives the same expectation values?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    The last two integrals don't seem to have an infinitesimal?
    $endgroup$
    – Gert
    Mar 23 at 0:18















2












$begingroup$


The time independent Schrodinger equation
$$-frachbar^22m fracd^2psidx^2+Vpsi = Epsi$$ can have many different solutions of $psi$ for a particular value of $E$.



For example, if we found a complex solution $psi(x)$ for a particular value of $E$, say $E_0$, we can write $psi(x)=a(x)+ib(x)$. Then $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ will also be solutions to the T.I.S.E with $E=E_0$. Furthermore $c_1a(x)+c_2b(x)$ will also be solutions with $c_1$ and $c_2$ being arbitrary constants.



I read that one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$. But does that mean all these different solutions represent the same physical state of a particle?



The expectation value of any dynamical variable $Q(x,p)$ is given by
$int psi^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)psi. $ How do we know for sure that $int a(x)^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)a(x) $ and $int b(x)^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)b(x)$ gives the same expectation values?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$











  • $begingroup$
    The last two integrals don't seem to have an infinitesimal?
    $endgroup$
    – Gert
    Mar 23 at 0:18













2












2








2


0



$begingroup$


The time independent Schrodinger equation
$$-frachbar^22m fracd^2psidx^2+Vpsi = Epsi$$ can have many different solutions of $psi$ for a particular value of $E$.



For example, if we found a complex solution $psi(x)$ for a particular value of $E$, say $E_0$, we can write $psi(x)=a(x)+ib(x)$. Then $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ will also be solutions to the T.I.S.E with $E=E_0$. Furthermore $c_1a(x)+c_2b(x)$ will also be solutions with $c_1$ and $c_2$ being arbitrary constants.



I read that one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$. But does that mean all these different solutions represent the same physical state of a particle?



The expectation value of any dynamical variable $Q(x,p)$ is given by
$int psi^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)psi. $ How do we know for sure that $int a(x)^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)a(x) $ and $int b(x)^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)b(x)$ gives the same expectation values?










share|cite|improve this question











$endgroup$




The time independent Schrodinger equation
$$-frachbar^22m fracd^2psidx^2+Vpsi = Epsi$$ can have many different solutions of $psi$ for a particular value of $E$.



For example, if we found a complex solution $psi(x)$ for a particular value of $E$, say $E_0$, we can write $psi(x)=a(x)+ib(x)$. Then $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ will also be solutions to the T.I.S.E with $E=E_0$. Furthermore $c_1a(x)+c_2b(x)$ will also be solutions with $c_1$ and $c_2$ being arbitrary constants.



I read that one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$. But does that mean all these different solutions represent the same physical state of a particle?



The expectation value of any dynamical variable $Q(x,p)$ is given by
$int psi^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)psi. $ How do we know for sure that $int a(x)^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)a(x) $ and $int b(x)^*Q(x,frachbarifracddx)b(x)$ gives the same expectation values?







quantum-mechanics wavefunction schroedinger-equation






share|cite|improve this question















share|cite|improve this question













share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question








edited Mar 23 at 2:56









Qmechanic

107k121981229




107k121981229










asked Mar 22 at 22:55









TaeNyFanTaeNyFan

54614




54614











  • $begingroup$
    The last two integrals don't seem to have an infinitesimal?
    $endgroup$
    – Gert
    Mar 23 at 0:18
















  • $begingroup$
    The last two integrals don't seem to have an infinitesimal?
    $endgroup$
    – Gert
    Mar 23 at 0:18















$begingroup$
The last two integrals don't seem to have an infinitesimal?
$endgroup$
– Gert
Mar 23 at 0:18




$begingroup$
The last two integrals don't seem to have an infinitesimal?
$endgroup$
– Gert
Mar 23 at 0:18










4 Answers
4






active

oldest

votes


















6












$begingroup$

  1. In ordinary quantum mechanics, two wavefunctions represent the same physical state if and only if they are multiples of each other, that is $psi$ and $cpsi$ represent the same state for any $cinmathbbC$. If you insist on wavefunctions being normalized, then $c$ is restricted to complex numbers of absolute value 1, i.e. number of the form $mathrme^mathrmik$ for some $kin[0,2pi)$.



  2. If $psi(x) = a(x) + mathrmib(x)$ is a solution of the Schrödinger equation, then it is not automatically true that $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are also solutions. It is "accidentally" true for the time-independent Schrödinger equation because applying complex conjugation shows us directly that $psi^ast(x)$ is a solution if $psi(x)$ is, and $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ can be obtained by linear combinations of $psi(x)$ and $psi^ast(x)$.



    There are now two cases: If $psi$ and $psi^ast$ are not linearly independent - i.e. one can be obtained from the other by multiplication with a complex constant - then the space of solutions for this energy is still one-dimensional, and there's only a single physical state. If they are linearly independent, then there are at least two distinct physical states with this energy.



    Note that already the free particle with $V=0$ gives a counter-example to the claim that all solutions for the same energy have the same values for all expectation values. There we have plane wave solutions $psi(x) = mathrme^mathrmipx$ and $psi^ast(x) = mathrme^-mathrmipx$ that are linearly-independent complex conjugates with the same energy that differ in the sign of their expectation value for the momentum operator $p$.







share|cite|improve this answer









$endgroup$




















    4












    $begingroup$

    Solutions can be degenerate with the same expectation value of the energy, but they can have different expectation values for other operators like angular momentum or it $z$ component.



    For example the hydrogenic wave functions with $n=2$: $2s$ and $2p$. And then there are three different $2p$ wave functions that can be written as linear combinations of $2p_x, 2p_y, 2p_z$ or of the spherical harmonics $Y_ell,m$ with $ell=1$ and $m=-1,0,1$.






    share|cite|improve this answer









    $endgroup$




















      4












      $begingroup$


      ... one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$.




      That statement is misleading because of how it uses the word "the," suggesting uniqueness. If both occurrances of "the" were replaced by "a," then the statement would make sense.



      A given observable will typically have different expectation values in two different states with the same energy. For example, when $V=0$, the functions $exp(pm ipx/hbar)$ both have energy $E=p^2/2m$, but they have different eigenvalues ($pm p$) of the momentum operator $P=-ihbarpartial/partial x$.



      (I'm being relaxed here about using words like "eigenstate" for non-normalizable functions, but I think those mathematical technicalities are beside the point of this question.)






      share|cite|improve this answer









      $endgroup$




















        1












        $begingroup$

        For a onedimensional equation like the one you propose something more certain may be said.



        Schrödinger equation is a second-order, linear and homogeneous ODE. Then a unique solution is determined giving $psi(x_0)$ and $psi'(x_0)$. As a consequence, there can't be more than two independent solutions (for a given $E$).



        The homogeneous boundary value problem ($psi(a)=psi(b)=0$ for given $a$, $b$, even infinite) is still more restricted: for each eigenvalue there is only one independent solution. In other words, eigenvalues are never degenerate.



        The proof makes use of the Wronskian. Let $psi_1$, $psi_2$ two
        solutions (for the same $E$ and the same boundary conditions). Define
        $$W(x) = psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x).$$
        It can be shown that $W(x)$ is a constant, the same for all $x$.
        If the boundary conditions are homogeneous, clearly $W(x)=0$ for all $x$:
        $$psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x) = 0$$
        $$psi_1'(x) over psi_1(x) = psi_2'(x) over psi_2(x)$$
        $$logpsi_1(x) = logpsi_2(x) + c$$
        $$psi_1(x) = psi_2(x),e^c$$
        q.e.d.



        The case of a free particle, with two solutions, is no
        counterexample, since in that case there are no homogeneous boundary conditions. Anyhow you get two independent solutions and no more.






        share|cite|improve this answer









        $endgroup$













          Your Answer





          StackExchange.ifUsing("editor", function ()
          return StackExchange.using("mathjaxEditing", function ()
          StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.creationCallbacks.add(function (editor, postfix)
          StackExchange.mathjaxEditing.prepareWmdForMathJax(editor, postfix, [["$", "$"], ["\\(","\\)"]]);
          );
          );
          , "mathjax-editing");

          StackExchange.ready(function()
          var channelOptions =
          tags: "".split(" "),
          id: "151"
          ;
          initTagRenderer("".split(" "), "".split(" "), channelOptions);

          StackExchange.using("externalEditor", function()
          // Have to fire editor after snippets, if snippets enabled
          if (StackExchange.settings.snippets.snippetsEnabled)
          StackExchange.using("snippets", function()
          createEditor();
          );

          else
          createEditor();

          );

          function createEditor()
          StackExchange.prepareEditor(
          heartbeatType: 'answer',
          autoActivateHeartbeat: false,
          convertImagesToLinks: false,
          noModals: true,
          showLowRepImageUploadWarning: true,
          reputationToPostImages: null,
          bindNavPrevention: true,
          postfix: "",
          imageUploader:
          brandingHtml: "Powered by u003ca class="icon-imgur-white" href="https://imgur.com/"u003eu003c/au003e",
          contentPolicyHtml: "User contributions licensed under u003ca href="https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/"u003ecc by-sa 3.0 with attribution requiredu003c/au003e u003ca href="https://stackoverflow.com/legal/content-policy"u003e(content policy)u003c/au003e",
          allowUrls: true
          ,
          noCode: true, onDemand: true,
          discardSelector: ".discard-answer"
          ,immediatelyShowMarkdownHelp:true
          );



          );













          draft saved

          draft discarded


















          StackExchange.ready(
          function ()
          StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fphysics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f468127%2fpicking-the-different-solutions-to-the-time-independent-schrodinger-eqaution%23new-answer', 'question_page');

          );

          Post as a guest















          Required, but never shown

























          4 Answers
          4






          active

          oldest

          votes








          4 Answers
          4






          active

          oldest

          votes









          active

          oldest

          votes






          active

          oldest

          votes









          6












          $begingroup$

          1. In ordinary quantum mechanics, two wavefunctions represent the same physical state if and only if they are multiples of each other, that is $psi$ and $cpsi$ represent the same state for any $cinmathbbC$. If you insist on wavefunctions being normalized, then $c$ is restricted to complex numbers of absolute value 1, i.e. number of the form $mathrme^mathrmik$ for some $kin[0,2pi)$.



          2. If $psi(x) = a(x) + mathrmib(x)$ is a solution of the Schrödinger equation, then it is not automatically true that $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are also solutions. It is "accidentally" true for the time-independent Schrödinger equation because applying complex conjugation shows us directly that $psi^ast(x)$ is a solution if $psi(x)$ is, and $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ can be obtained by linear combinations of $psi(x)$ and $psi^ast(x)$.



            There are now two cases: If $psi$ and $psi^ast$ are not linearly independent - i.e. one can be obtained from the other by multiplication with a complex constant - then the space of solutions for this energy is still one-dimensional, and there's only a single physical state. If they are linearly independent, then there are at least two distinct physical states with this energy.



            Note that already the free particle with $V=0$ gives a counter-example to the claim that all solutions for the same energy have the same values for all expectation values. There we have plane wave solutions $psi(x) = mathrme^mathrmipx$ and $psi^ast(x) = mathrme^-mathrmipx$ that are linearly-independent complex conjugates with the same energy that differ in the sign of their expectation value for the momentum operator $p$.







          share|cite|improve this answer









          $endgroup$

















            6












            $begingroup$

            1. In ordinary quantum mechanics, two wavefunctions represent the same physical state if and only if they are multiples of each other, that is $psi$ and $cpsi$ represent the same state for any $cinmathbbC$. If you insist on wavefunctions being normalized, then $c$ is restricted to complex numbers of absolute value 1, i.e. number of the form $mathrme^mathrmik$ for some $kin[0,2pi)$.



            2. If $psi(x) = a(x) + mathrmib(x)$ is a solution of the Schrödinger equation, then it is not automatically true that $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are also solutions. It is "accidentally" true for the time-independent Schrödinger equation because applying complex conjugation shows us directly that $psi^ast(x)$ is a solution if $psi(x)$ is, and $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ can be obtained by linear combinations of $psi(x)$ and $psi^ast(x)$.



              There are now two cases: If $psi$ and $psi^ast$ are not linearly independent - i.e. one can be obtained from the other by multiplication with a complex constant - then the space of solutions for this energy is still one-dimensional, and there's only a single physical state. If they are linearly independent, then there are at least two distinct physical states with this energy.



              Note that already the free particle with $V=0$ gives a counter-example to the claim that all solutions for the same energy have the same values for all expectation values. There we have plane wave solutions $psi(x) = mathrme^mathrmipx$ and $psi^ast(x) = mathrme^-mathrmipx$ that are linearly-independent complex conjugates with the same energy that differ in the sign of their expectation value for the momentum operator $p$.







            share|cite|improve this answer









            $endgroup$















              6












              6








              6





              $begingroup$

              1. In ordinary quantum mechanics, two wavefunctions represent the same physical state if and only if they are multiples of each other, that is $psi$ and $cpsi$ represent the same state for any $cinmathbbC$. If you insist on wavefunctions being normalized, then $c$ is restricted to complex numbers of absolute value 1, i.e. number of the form $mathrme^mathrmik$ for some $kin[0,2pi)$.



              2. If $psi(x) = a(x) + mathrmib(x)$ is a solution of the Schrödinger equation, then it is not automatically true that $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are also solutions. It is "accidentally" true for the time-independent Schrödinger equation because applying complex conjugation shows us directly that $psi^ast(x)$ is a solution if $psi(x)$ is, and $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ can be obtained by linear combinations of $psi(x)$ and $psi^ast(x)$.



                There are now two cases: If $psi$ and $psi^ast$ are not linearly independent - i.e. one can be obtained from the other by multiplication with a complex constant - then the space of solutions for this energy is still one-dimensional, and there's only a single physical state. If they are linearly independent, then there are at least two distinct physical states with this energy.



                Note that already the free particle with $V=0$ gives a counter-example to the claim that all solutions for the same energy have the same values for all expectation values. There we have plane wave solutions $psi(x) = mathrme^mathrmipx$ and $psi^ast(x) = mathrme^-mathrmipx$ that are linearly-independent complex conjugates with the same energy that differ in the sign of their expectation value for the momentum operator $p$.







              share|cite|improve this answer









              $endgroup$



              1. In ordinary quantum mechanics, two wavefunctions represent the same physical state if and only if they are multiples of each other, that is $psi$ and $cpsi$ represent the same state for any $cinmathbbC$. If you insist on wavefunctions being normalized, then $c$ is restricted to complex numbers of absolute value 1, i.e. number of the form $mathrme^mathrmik$ for some $kin[0,2pi)$.



              2. If $psi(x) = a(x) + mathrmib(x)$ is a solution of the Schrödinger equation, then it is not automatically true that $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ are also solutions. It is "accidentally" true for the time-independent Schrödinger equation because applying complex conjugation shows us directly that $psi^ast(x)$ is a solution if $psi(x)$ is, and $a(x)$ and $b(x)$ can be obtained by linear combinations of $psi(x)$ and $psi^ast(x)$.



                There are now two cases: If $psi$ and $psi^ast$ are not linearly independent - i.e. one can be obtained from the other by multiplication with a complex constant - then the space of solutions for this energy is still one-dimensional, and there's only a single physical state. If they are linearly independent, then there are at least two distinct physical states with this energy.



                Note that already the free particle with $V=0$ gives a counter-example to the claim that all solutions for the same energy have the same values for all expectation values. There we have plane wave solutions $psi(x) = mathrme^mathrmipx$ and $psi^ast(x) = mathrme^-mathrmipx$ that are linearly-independent complex conjugates with the same energy that differ in the sign of their expectation value for the momentum operator $p$.








              share|cite|improve this answer












              share|cite|improve this answer



              share|cite|improve this answer










              answered Mar 22 at 23:29









              ACuriousMindACuriousMind

              73.1k18130323




              73.1k18130323





















                  4












                  $begingroup$

                  Solutions can be degenerate with the same expectation value of the energy, but they can have different expectation values for other operators like angular momentum or it $z$ component.



                  For example the hydrogenic wave functions with $n=2$: $2s$ and $2p$. And then there are three different $2p$ wave functions that can be written as linear combinations of $2p_x, 2p_y, 2p_z$ or of the spherical harmonics $Y_ell,m$ with $ell=1$ and $m=-1,0,1$.






                  share|cite|improve this answer









                  $endgroup$

















                    4












                    $begingroup$

                    Solutions can be degenerate with the same expectation value of the energy, but they can have different expectation values for other operators like angular momentum or it $z$ component.



                    For example the hydrogenic wave functions with $n=2$: $2s$ and $2p$. And then there are three different $2p$ wave functions that can be written as linear combinations of $2p_x, 2p_y, 2p_z$ or of the spherical harmonics $Y_ell,m$ with $ell=1$ and $m=-1,0,1$.






                    share|cite|improve this answer









                    $endgroup$















                      4












                      4








                      4





                      $begingroup$

                      Solutions can be degenerate with the same expectation value of the energy, but they can have different expectation values for other operators like angular momentum or it $z$ component.



                      For example the hydrogenic wave functions with $n=2$: $2s$ and $2p$. And then there are three different $2p$ wave functions that can be written as linear combinations of $2p_x, 2p_y, 2p_z$ or of the spherical harmonics $Y_ell,m$ with $ell=1$ and $m=-1,0,1$.






                      share|cite|improve this answer









                      $endgroup$



                      Solutions can be degenerate with the same expectation value of the energy, but they can have different expectation values for other operators like angular momentum or it $z$ component.



                      For example the hydrogenic wave functions with $n=2$: $2s$ and $2p$. And then there are three different $2p$ wave functions that can be written as linear combinations of $2p_x, 2p_y, 2p_z$ or of the spherical harmonics $Y_ell,m$ with $ell=1$ and $m=-1,0,1$.







                      share|cite|improve this answer












                      share|cite|improve this answer



                      share|cite|improve this answer










                      answered Mar 22 at 23:11









                      PieterPieter

                      9,22231536




                      9,22231536





















                          4












                          $begingroup$


                          ... one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$.




                          That statement is misleading because of how it uses the word "the," suggesting uniqueness. If both occurrances of "the" were replaced by "a," then the statement would make sense.



                          A given observable will typically have different expectation values in two different states with the same energy. For example, when $V=0$, the functions $exp(pm ipx/hbar)$ both have energy $E=p^2/2m$, but they have different eigenvalues ($pm p$) of the momentum operator $P=-ihbarpartial/partial x$.



                          (I'm being relaxed here about using words like "eigenstate" for non-normalizable functions, but I think those mathematical technicalities are beside the point of this question.)






                          share|cite|improve this answer









                          $endgroup$

















                            4












                            $begingroup$


                            ... one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$.




                            That statement is misleading because of how it uses the word "the," suggesting uniqueness. If both occurrances of "the" were replaced by "a," then the statement would make sense.



                            A given observable will typically have different expectation values in two different states with the same energy. For example, when $V=0$, the functions $exp(pm ipx/hbar)$ both have energy $E=p^2/2m$, but they have different eigenvalues ($pm p$) of the momentum operator $P=-ihbarpartial/partial x$.



                            (I'm being relaxed here about using words like "eigenstate" for non-normalizable functions, but I think those mathematical technicalities are beside the point of this question.)






                            share|cite|improve this answer









                            $endgroup$















                              4












                              4








                              4





                              $begingroup$


                              ... one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$.




                              That statement is misleading because of how it uses the word "the," suggesting uniqueness. If both occurrances of "the" were replaced by "a," then the statement would make sense.



                              A given observable will typically have different expectation values in two different states with the same energy. For example, when $V=0$, the functions $exp(pm ipx/hbar)$ both have energy $E=p^2/2m$, but they have different eigenvalues ($pm p$) of the momentum operator $P=-ihbarpartial/partial x$.



                              (I'm being relaxed here about using words like "eigenstate" for non-normalizable functions, but I think those mathematical technicalities are beside the point of this question.)






                              share|cite|improve this answer









                              $endgroup$




                              ... one can always choose any of these solutions as the solution for the stationary state with energy $E_0$.




                              That statement is misleading because of how it uses the word "the," suggesting uniqueness. If both occurrances of "the" were replaced by "a," then the statement would make sense.



                              A given observable will typically have different expectation values in two different states with the same energy. For example, when $V=0$, the functions $exp(pm ipx/hbar)$ both have energy $E=p^2/2m$, but they have different eigenvalues ($pm p$) of the momentum operator $P=-ihbarpartial/partial x$.



                              (I'm being relaxed here about using words like "eigenstate" for non-normalizable functions, but I think those mathematical technicalities are beside the point of this question.)







                              share|cite|improve this answer












                              share|cite|improve this answer



                              share|cite|improve this answer










                              answered Mar 22 at 23:12









                              Chiral AnomalyChiral Anomaly

                              12.7k21542




                              12.7k21542





















                                  1












                                  $begingroup$

                                  For a onedimensional equation like the one you propose something more certain may be said.



                                  Schrödinger equation is a second-order, linear and homogeneous ODE. Then a unique solution is determined giving $psi(x_0)$ and $psi'(x_0)$. As a consequence, there can't be more than two independent solutions (for a given $E$).



                                  The homogeneous boundary value problem ($psi(a)=psi(b)=0$ for given $a$, $b$, even infinite) is still more restricted: for each eigenvalue there is only one independent solution. In other words, eigenvalues are never degenerate.



                                  The proof makes use of the Wronskian. Let $psi_1$, $psi_2$ two
                                  solutions (for the same $E$ and the same boundary conditions). Define
                                  $$W(x) = psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x).$$
                                  It can be shown that $W(x)$ is a constant, the same for all $x$.
                                  If the boundary conditions are homogeneous, clearly $W(x)=0$ for all $x$:
                                  $$psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x) = 0$$
                                  $$psi_1'(x) over psi_1(x) = psi_2'(x) over psi_2(x)$$
                                  $$logpsi_1(x) = logpsi_2(x) + c$$
                                  $$psi_1(x) = psi_2(x),e^c$$
                                  q.e.d.



                                  The case of a free particle, with two solutions, is no
                                  counterexample, since in that case there are no homogeneous boundary conditions. Anyhow you get two independent solutions and no more.






                                  share|cite|improve this answer









                                  $endgroup$

















                                    1












                                    $begingroup$

                                    For a onedimensional equation like the one you propose something more certain may be said.



                                    Schrödinger equation is a second-order, linear and homogeneous ODE. Then a unique solution is determined giving $psi(x_0)$ and $psi'(x_0)$. As a consequence, there can't be more than two independent solutions (for a given $E$).



                                    The homogeneous boundary value problem ($psi(a)=psi(b)=0$ for given $a$, $b$, even infinite) is still more restricted: for each eigenvalue there is only one independent solution. In other words, eigenvalues are never degenerate.



                                    The proof makes use of the Wronskian. Let $psi_1$, $psi_2$ two
                                    solutions (for the same $E$ and the same boundary conditions). Define
                                    $$W(x) = psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x).$$
                                    It can be shown that $W(x)$ is a constant, the same for all $x$.
                                    If the boundary conditions are homogeneous, clearly $W(x)=0$ for all $x$:
                                    $$psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x) = 0$$
                                    $$psi_1'(x) over psi_1(x) = psi_2'(x) over psi_2(x)$$
                                    $$logpsi_1(x) = logpsi_2(x) + c$$
                                    $$psi_1(x) = psi_2(x),e^c$$
                                    q.e.d.



                                    The case of a free particle, with two solutions, is no
                                    counterexample, since in that case there are no homogeneous boundary conditions. Anyhow you get two independent solutions and no more.






                                    share|cite|improve this answer









                                    $endgroup$















                                      1












                                      1








                                      1





                                      $begingroup$

                                      For a onedimensional equation like the one you propose something more certain may be said.



                                      Schrödinger equation is a second-order, linear and homogeneous ODE. Then a unique solution is determined giving $psi(x_0)$ and $psi'(x_0)$. As a consequence, there can't be more than two independent solutions (for a given $E$).



                                      The homogeneous boundary value problem ($psi(a)=psi(b)=0$ for given $a$, $b$, even infinite) is still more restricted: for each eigenvalue there is only one independent solution. In other words, eigenvalues are never degenerate.



                                      The proof makes use of the Wronskian. Let $psi_1$, $psi_2$ two
                                      solutions (for the same $E$ and the same boundary conditions). Define
                                      $$W(x) = psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x).$$
                                      It can be shown that $W(x)$ is a constant, the same for all $x$.
                                      If the boundary conditions are homogeneous, clearly $W(x)=0$ for all $x$:
                                      $$psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x) = 0$$
                                      $$psi_1'(x) over psi_1(x) = psi_2'(x) over psi_2(x)$$
                                      $$logpsi_1(x) = logpsi_2(x) + c$$
                                      $$psi_1(x) = psi_2(x),e^c$$
                                      q.e.d.



                                      The case of a free particle, with two solutions, is no
                                      counterexample, since in that case there are no homogeneous boundary conditions. Anyhow you get two independent solutions and no more.






                                      share|cite|improve this answer









                                      $endgroup$



                                      For a onedimensional equation like the one you propose something more certain may be said.



                                      Schrödinger equation is a second-order, linear and homogeneous ODE. Then a unique solution is determined giving $psi(x_0)$ and $psi'(x_0)$. As a consequence, there can't be more than two independent solutions (for a given $E$).



                                      The homogeneous boundary value problem ($psi(a)=psi(b)=0$ for given $a$, $b$, even infinite) is still more restricted: for each eigenvalue there is only one independent solution. In other words, eigenvalues are never degenerate.



                                      The proof makes use of the Wronskian. Let $psi_1$, $psi_2$ two
                                      solutions (for the same $E$ and the same boundary conditions). Define
                                      $$W(x) = psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x).$$
                                      It can be shown that $W(x)$ is a constant, the same for all $x$.
                                      If the boundary conditions are homogeneous, clearly $W(x)=0$ for all $x$:
                                      $$psi_1(x),psi_2'(x) - psi_1'(x),psi_2(x) = 0$$
                                      $$psi_1'(x) over psi_1(x) = psi_2'(x) over psi_2(x)$$
                                      $$logpsi_1(x) = logpsi_2(x) + c$$
                                      $$psi_1(x) = psi_2(x),e^c$$
                                      q.e.d.



                                      The case of a free particle, with two solutions, is no
                                      counterexample, since in that case there are no homogeneous boundary conditions. Anyhow you get two independent solutions and no more.







                                      share|cite|improve this answer












                                      share|cite|improve this answer



                                      share|cite|improve this answer










                                      answered Mar 24 at 20:41









                                      Elio FabriElio Fabri

                                      3,2651214




                                      3,2651214



























                                          draft saved

                                          draft discarded
















































                                          Thanks for contributing an answer to Physics Stack Exchange!


                                          • Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!

                                          But avoid


                                          • Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.

                                          • Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.

                                          Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.


                                          To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.




                                          draft saved


                                          draft discarded














                                          StackExchange.ready(
                                          function ()
                                          StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fphysics.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f468127%2fpicking-the-different-solutions-to-the-time-independent-schrodinger-eqaution%23new-answer', 'question_page');

                                          );

                                          Post as a guest















                                          Required, but never shown





















































                                          Required, but never shown














                                          Required, but never shown












                                          Required, but never shown







                                          Required, but never shown

































                                          Required, but never shown














                                          Required, but never shown












                                          Required, but never shown







                                          Required, but never shown







                                          Popular posts from this blog

                                          Marja Vauras Lähteet | Aiheesta muualla | NavigointivalikkoMarja Vauras Turun yliopiston tutkimusportaalissaInfobox OKSuomalaisen Tiedeakatemian varsinaiset jäsenetKasvatustieteiden tiedekunnan dekaanit ja muu johtoMarja VaurasKoulutusvienti on kestävyys- ja ketteryyslaji (2.5.2017)laajentamallaWorldCat Identities0000 0001 0855 9405n86069603utb201588738523620927

                                          Which is better: GPT or RelGAN for text generation?2019 Community Moderator ElectionWhat is the difference between TextGAN and LM for text generation?GANs (generative adversarial networks) possible for text as well?Generator loss not decreasing- text to image synthesisChoosing a right algorithm for template-based text generationHow should I format input and output for text generation with LSTMsGumbel Softmax vs Vanilla Softmax for GAN trainingWhich neural network to choose for classification from text/speech?NLP text autoencoder that generates text in poetic meterWhat is the interpretation of the expectation notation in the GAN formulation?What is the difference between TextGAN and LM for text generation?How to prepare the data for text generation task

                                          Is this part of the description of the Archfey warlock's Misty Escape feature redundant?When is entropic ward considered “used”?How does the reaction timing work for Wrath of the Storm? Can it potentially prevent the damage from the triggering attack?Does the Dark Arts Archlich warlock patrons's Arcane Invisibility activate every time you cast a level 1+ spell?When attacking while invisible, when exactly does invisibility break?Can I cast Hellish Rebuke on my turn?Do I have to “pre-cast” a reaction spell in order for it to be triggered?What happens if a Player Misty Escapes into an Invisible CreatureCan a reaction interrupt multiattack?Does the Fiend-patron warlock's Hurl Through Hell feature dispel effects that require the target to be on the same plane as the caster?What are you allowed to do while using the Warlock's Eldritch Master feature?