Why doesn't Newton's third law mean a person bounces back to where they started when they hit the ground? [closed]2019 Community Moderator Election Unicorn Meta Zoo #1: Why another podcast? Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara 2019 Moderator Election Q&A - QuestionnaireIf F(action) =F(reaction), why doesn't a ball bounce to its original height?With Newton's third law, why are things capable of moving?Why don't all objects bounce like rubber balls?Why does a Ball bounce back if Forces are Equal and Opposite?Clarification regarding Newton's Third Law of Motion and why movement is possibleAccording to Newton's third law, why don't Action and Reaction make equilibrium?Person Pushing a Block vs. People Pushing off Each Other - Newton's Third LawNewton's third law of motion when moving between two surfacesConfused about Newton's 3rd lawHow did tension developed in a string when two equal and opposite forces are applied on the same body?Why does a Ball bounce back if Forces are Equal and Opposite?Why doesn't an object that collides with one that is at rest just do a 180?Newton's $3^rd$ Law of motionWhy does Newton's Third Law work for fields?
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Why doesn't Newton's third law mean a person bounces back to where they started when they hit the ground? [closed]
2019 Community Moderator Election
Unicorn Meta Zoo #1: Why another podcast?
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
2019 Moderator Election Q&A - QuestionnaireIf F(action) =F(reaction), why doesn't a ball bounce to its original height?With Newton's third law, why are things capable of moving?Why don't all objects bounce like rubber balls?Why does a Ball bounce back if Forces are Equal and Opposite?Clarification regarding Newton's Third Law of Motion and why movement is possibleAccording to Newton's third law, why don't Action and Reaction make equilibrium?Person Pushing a Block vs. People Pushing off Each Other - Newton's Third LawNewton's third law of motion when moving between two surfacesConfused about Newton's 3rd lawHow did tension developed in a string when two equal and opposite forces are applied on the same body?Why does a Ball bounce back if Forces are Equal and Opposite?Why doesn't an object that collides with one that is at rest just do a 180?Newton's $3^rd$ Law of motionWhy does Newton's Third Law work for fields?
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Why doesn't a person bounce back after falling down like a ball? If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction. If we take the example of ball then it comes back with the same force as it falls down. But in the case of a human body, this law is not applicable. Why?
newtonian-mechanics forces conservation-laws collision free-body-diagram
edited Apr 7 at 13:18
Jens
2,44611531
asked Apr 5 at 13:11
nameera jabeennameera jabeen
12313
$endgroup$
closed as unclear what you're asking by Kyle Kanos, Jon Custer, stafusa, Rory Alsop, ZeroTheHero Apr 11 at 12:04
Please clarify your specific problem or add additional details to highlight exactly what you need. As it's currently written, it’s hard to tell exactly what you're asking. See the How to Ask page for help clarifying this question. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
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Why doesn't a person bounce back after falling down like a ball? If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction. If we take the example of ball then it comes back with the same force as it falls down. But in the case of a human body, this law is not applicable. Why?
newtonian-mechanics forces conservation-laws collision free-body-diagram
edited Apr 7 at 13:18
Jens
2,44611531
asked Apr 5 at 13:11
nameera jabeennameera jabeen
12313
$endgroup$
closed as unclear what you're asking by Kyle Kanos, Jon Custer, stafusa, Rory Alsop, ZeroTheHero Apr 11 at 12:04
Please clarify your specific problem or add additional details to highlight exactly what you need. As it's currently written, it’s hard to tell exactly what you're asking. See the How to Ask page for help clarifying this question. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
$begingroup$
Related: physics.stackexchange.com/q/45653/2451 and links therein.
$endgroup$
– Qmechanic♦
Apr 5 at 13:54
1
$begingroup$
Related question
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 7 at 22:06
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If you used a trampoline instead of, say, concrete, then you get the bounce. The trampoline can store the required energy. Concrete not so much.
$endgroup$
– chasly from UK
Apr 8 at 10:08
1
$begingroup$
Newton's third law does not say that what goes up must come down (or any variation on this). It does not in any way say that if some specific thing happens, then afterwards this other thing happens. It's a very common misconception, though.
$endgroup$
– Arthur
Apr 8 at 13:42
2
$begingroup$
I don't see why this question was closed. It seems pretty straightforward to me.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 20 at 15:51
|
show 1 more comment
$begingroup$
Why doesn't a person bounce back after falling down like a ball? If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction. If we take the example of ball then it comes back with the same force as it falls down. But in the case of a human body, this law is not applicable. Why?
newtonian-mechanics forces conservation-laws collision free-body-diagram
edited Apr 7 at 13:18
Jens
2,44611531
asked Apr 5 at 13:11
nameera jabeennameera jabeen
12313
$endgroup$
Why doesn't a person bounce back after falling down like a ball? If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction. If we take the example of ball then it comes back with the same force as it falls down. But in the case of a human body, this law is not applicable. Why?
newtonian-mechanics forces conservation-laws collision free-body-diagram
newtonian-mechanics forces conservation-laws collision free-body-diagram
edited Apr 7 at 13:18
Jens
2,44611531
asked Apr 5 at 13:11
nameera jabeennameera jabeen
12313
edited Apr 7 at 13:18
Jens
2,44611531
asked Apr 5 at 13:11
nameera jabeennameera jabeen
12313
edited Apr 7 at 13:18
Jens
2,44611531
edited Apr 7 at 13:18
Jens
2,44611531
edited Apr 7 at 13:18
Jens
2,44611531
2,44611531
asked Apr 5 at 13:11
nameera jabeennameera jabeen
12313
asked Apr 5 at 13:11
nameera jabeennameera jabeen
12313
asked Apr 5 at 13:11
nameera jabeennameera jabeen
12313
12313
closed as unclear what you're asking by Kyle Kanos, Jon Custer, stafusa, Rory Alsop, ZeroTheHero Apr 11 at 12:04
Please clarify your specific problem or add additional details to highlight exactly what you need. As it's currently written, it’s hard to tell exactly what you're asking. See the How to Ask page for help clarifying this question. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
closed as unclear what you're asking by Kyle Kanos, Jon Custer, stafusa, Rory Alsop, ZeroTheHero Apr 11 at 12:04
Please clarify your specific problem or add additional details to highlight exactly what you need. As it's currently written, it’s hard to tell exactly what you're asking. See the How to Ask page for help clarifying this question. If this question can be reworded to fit the rules in the help center, please edit the question.
$begingroup$
Related: physics.stackexchange.com/q/45653/2451 and links therein.
$endgroup$
– Qmechanic♦
Apr 5 at 13:54
1
$begingroup$
Related question
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 7 at 22:06
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If you used a trampoline instead of, say, concrete, then you get the bounce. The trampoline can store the required energy. Concrete not so much.
$endgroup$
– chasly from UK
Apr 8 at 10:08
1
$begingroup$
Newton's third law does not say that what goes up must come down (or any variation on this). It does not in any way say that if some specific thing happens, then afterwards this other thing happens. It's a very common misconception, though.
$endgroup$
– Arthur
Apr 8 at 13:42
2
$begingroup$
I don't see why this question was closed. It seems pretty straightforward to me.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 20 at 15:51
|
show 1 more comment
$begingroup$
Related: physics.stackexchange.com/q/45653/2451 and links therein.
$endgroup$
– Qmechanic♦
Apr 5 at 13:54
1
$begingroup$
Related question
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 7 at 22:06
$begingroup$
If you used a trampoline instead of, say, concrete, then you get the bounce. The trampoline can store the required energy. Concrete not so much.
$endgroup$
– chasly from UK
Apr 8 at 10:08
1
$begingroup$
Newton's third law does not say that what goes up must come down (or any variation on this). It does not in any way say that if some specific thing happens, then afterwards this other thing happens. It's a very common misconception, though.
$endgroup$
– Arthur
Apr 8 at 13:42
2
$begingroup$
I don't see why this question was closed. It seems pretty straightforward to me.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 20 at 15:51
$begingroup$
Related: physics.stackexchange.com/q/45653/2451 and links therein.
$endgroup$
– Qmechanic♦
Apr 5 at 13:54
$begingroup$
Related: physics.stackexchange.com/q/45653/2451 and links therein.
$endgroup$
– Qmechanic♦
Apr 5 at 13:54
1
1
$begingroup$
Related question
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 7 at 22:06
$begingroup$
Related question
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 7 at 22:06
$begingroup$
If you used a trampoline instead of, say, concrete, then you get the bounce. The trampoline can store the required energy. Concrete not so much.
$endgroup$
– chasly from UK
Apr 8 at 10:08
$begingroup$
If you used a trampoline instead of, say, concrete, then you get the bounce. The trampoline can store the required energy. Concrete not so much.
$endgroup$
– chasly from UK
Apr 8 at 10:08
1
1
$begingroup$
Newton's third law does not say that what goes up must come down (or any variation on this). It does not in any way say that if some specific thing happens, then afterwards this other thing happens. It's a very common misconception, though.
$endgroup$
– Arthur
Apr 8 at 13:42
$begingroup$
Newton's third law does not say that what goes up must come down (or any variation on this). It does not in any way say that if some specific thing happens, then afterwards this other thing happens. It's a very common misconception, though.
$endgroup$
– Arthur
Apr 8 at 13:42
2
2
$begingroup$
I don't see why this question was closed. It seems pretty straightforward to me.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 20 at 15:51
$begingroup$
I don't see why this question was closed. It seems pretty straightforward to me.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 20 at 15:51
|
show 1 more comment
6 Answers
6
active
oldest
votes
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Newton's third law just says when the person is hitting the floor the force the person exerts on the ground is equal to the force the ground exerts on the person. i.e. all forces are interactions.
Newton's third law does not say that all collisions are elastic, which is what you are proposing. When someone hits the floor most of the energy is absorbed by the person through deformation (as well as the floor, depending on what type of floor it is), but there is barely any rebound since people tend to not be very elastic. i.e. the deformation does not involve storing the energy to be released back into kinetic energy. Contrast this with a bouncy ball where much of the energy goes into deforming the ball, but since it is very elastic it is able to spring back and put energy back into motion. However, it is unlikely the collision is still perfectly elastic, as you seem to suggest in your question.
In summary, Newton's third law tells us that action-reaction force pairs must have equal magnitudes and opposite directions, but it doesn't tell us anything about what the magnitude of these forces actually are. Your misunderstanding likely comes from the imprecise usage of the words "action" and "reaction". In this case, these words refer to just forces, not entire processes. You can get some confusing questions if you don't understand this. For example, why is it that when I open my refrigerator that my refrigerator doesn't also open me?
answered Apr 5 at 13:23
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.7k42557
$endgroup$
11
$begingroup$
to summarise: because human beings go splat rather than boing when hitting the ground.
$endgroup$
– jwenting
Apr 8 at 6:38
$begingroup$
now you’re talking my language :D
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– Ubaid Hassan
Apr 13 at 1:01
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When your body hits the floor, it does receive an equal and opposite reaction force from the floor. But unlike a ball a body is a complex object. So not all energy is transferred back as kinetic energy. Some energy is used to produce sound, some is used to deform your body... etc. I think you are confusing force with energy. Does every ball bounce back the same amount? Newton's 3rd law talks about force only. More force doesn't always (mostly) equal to more work done.
In your case, if all the force was used to change the body's kinetic energy somehow (which is not realistically possible), then it would have bounced back the same amount.
edited Apr 7 at 13:20
Jens
2,44611531
answered Apr 5 at 13:35
LikhonLikhon
15810
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction.
That's not a correct statement of Newton's third law.
Newton's third law of motion actually says: "If one object exerts a force on another object, then the second object also exerts a force on the first object, which is of the same magnitude but in the opposite direction."
So in this case, what Newton's third law is saying is: "If the floor pushes up on a person with a certain amount of force, then the person pushes down on the floor with the same amount of force." From this, there's no reason to think that the person would bounce back to his initial position.
answered Apr 5 at 21:39
Tanner SwettTanner Swett
1918
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1
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Newton defined "action" to mean "change of momentum", so that the original statement is precise, but that context is not commonly given with the quote.
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– aschepler
Apr 6 at 11:32
2
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I was being a little loose with my words. Newton wrote it correctly, but as far as I know, the word "action" isn't used that way in modern English. So I feel safe calling that phrasing incorrect.
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– Tanner Swett
Apr 7 at 1:31
add a comment |
$begingroup$
It's true that on the impact the human body experiences a force upwards equal to the force the body exerts downwards on the Earth: $vecF=fracDeltavecpDelta t$. Now $Deltavecp$ doesn't send the body's momentum in the opposite direction, but instead, all the momentum change is used to crack the bones, or more general deform the body in a horrible way (unless the person jumps from a small height, in which case he or she can give his(her)self an upward force by stretching his legs in which case he can reach the same height as where he came from, or even higher; in this case though, the energy necessary to return to the same hight comes from the body, which makes it an explosive collision and here we are talking about an inelastic collision). Some parts may bounce back upwards but are pulled back again by the rest of the body. So all kinetic energy has conversed in other forms of energy (including kinetic energy $frac12mvec v^2$ in which most $vecv$'s don't have a direction upwards).
answered Apr 6 at 15:24
descheleschilderdescheleschilder
4,30921445
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1
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Momentum isn't used to crack bones. That's kinetic energy.
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– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:25
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Well, I think that's an equivalent way to say it. A change in momentum can crack bones. But I made an edit.
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– descheleschilder
Apr 6 at 15:28
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You wrote "all the momentum is used to crack the bones". You can't use up momentum like that.
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– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:28
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Newton's third law states that when a particle applies a force on another particle then the former experiences an equal but opposite force from the other.When a ball hits the ground it comes back due to the fact that it experiences an elastic collsion(that is does not undergo any deformation).Think about a fur ball,will it come back,obviously no,why is that so?This is because when a fur ball collides with the ground(assuming a concrete ground)it undergoes deformation (due to the reaction force from the ground) and the kinetic energy of the ball is used up in deforming the ball.Same is the case for a human being who undergoes deformation on hitting the ground and hence does not come back to it's initial position.
answered Apr 7 at 15:34
SagnikSagnik
695
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Energy is not lost, but it is expended in different ways when different objects collide.
A more visceral statement of these principles:
Drop a rubber ball on the floor. As it hits the floor it stores up spring energy inside itself, and then bounces back almost as high as the start point, losing only a little energy to friction.
Drop a hard billiard ball on the floor. It bounces a bit, but much of the energy gets spent making a dent in the floor.
Drop a sphere of soft clay on the floor. It goes "splat" - most of the energy is spent pushing the clay out sideways. (There may be a small crown on the blob of clay on the floor where some of it did bounce back a bit.)
Drop a human being on the floor. Where does the energy go? It goes into bruising skin and muscles, bouncing internal organs back and forth, forcing air out of the person's lungs, swear words, etc. It takes quite a forceful impact to have enough leftover energy yo make a human being bounce enough to see.
The concept of a spherical cow is often used to describe the way real-world objects are simplified to make the underlying physics easier to describe; in this case you seem to be thinking of a spherical person.
answered Apr 7 at 21:28
arparp
1012
$endgroup$
add a comment |
6 Answers
6
active
oldest
votes
6 Answers
6
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Newton's third law just says when the person is hitting the floor the force the person exerts on the ground is equal to the force the ground exerts on the person. i.e. all forces are interactions.
Newton's third law does not say that all collisions are elastic, which is what you are proposing. When someone hits the floor most of the energy is absorbed by the person through deformation (as well as the floor, depending on what type of floor it is), but there is barely any rebound since people tend to not be very elastic. i.e. the deformation does not involve storing the energy to be released back into kinetic energy. Contrast this with a bouncy ball where much of the energy goes into deforming the ball, but since it is very elastic it is able to spring back and put energy back into motion. However, it is unlikely the collision is still perfectly elastic, as you seem to suggest in your question.
In summary, Newton's third law tells us that action-reaction force pairs must have equal magnitudes and opposite directions, but it doesn't tell us anything about what the magnitude of these forces actually are. Your misunderstanding likely comes from the imprecise usage of the words "action" and "reaction". In this case, these words refer to just forces, not entire processes. You can get some confusing questions if you don't understand this. For example, why is it that when I open my refrigerator that my refrigerator doesn't also open me?
answered Apr 5 at 13:23
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.7k42557
$endgroup$
11
$begingroup$
to summarise: because human beings go splat rather than boing when hitting the ground.
$endgroup$
– jwenting
Apr 8 at 6:38
$begingroup$
now you’re talking my language :D
$endgroup$
– Ubaid Hassan
Apr 13 at 1:01
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Newton's third law just says when the person is hitting the floor the force the person exerts on the ground is equal to the force the ground exerts on the person. i.e. all forces are interactions.
Newton's third law does not say that all collisions are elastic, which is what you are proposing. When someone hits the floor most of the energy is absorbed by the person through deformation (as well as the floor, depending on what type of floor it is), but there is barely any rebound since people tend to not be very elastic. i.e. the deformation does not involve storing the energy to be released back into kinetic energy. Contrast this with a bouncy ball where much of the energy goes into deforming the ball, but since it is very elastic it is able to spring back and put energy back into motion. However, it is unlikely the collision is still perfectly elastic, as you seem to suggest in your question.
In summary, Newton's third law tells us that action-reaction force pairs must have equal magnitudes and opposite directions, but it doesn't tell us anything about what the magnitude of these forces actually are. Your misunderstanding likely comes from the imprecise usage of the words "action" and "reaction". In this case, these words refer to just forces, not entire processes. You can get some confusing questions if you don't understand this. For example, why is it that when I open my refrigerator that my refrigerator doesn't also open me?
answered Apr 5 at 13:23
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.7k42557
$endgroup$
11
$begingroup$
to summarise: because human beings go splat rather than boing when hitting the ground.
$endgroup$
– jwenting
Apr 8 at 6:38
$begingroup$
now you’re talking my language :D
$endgroup$
– Ubaid Hassan
Apr 13 at 1:01
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Newton's third law just says when the person is hitting the floor the force the person exerts on the ground is equal to the force the ground exerts on the person. i.e. all forces are interactions.
Newton's third law does not say that all collisions are elastic, which is what you are proposing. When someone hits the floor most of the energy is absorbed by the person through deformation (as well as the floor, depending on what type of floor it is), but there is barely any rebound since people tend to not be very elastic. i.e. the deformation does not involve storing the energy to be released back into kinetic energy. Contrast this with a bouncy ball where much of the energy goes into deforming the ball, but since it is very elastic it is able to spring back and put energy back into motion. However, it is unlikely the collision is still perfectly elastic, as you seem to suggest in your question.
In summary, Newton's third law tells us that action-reaction force pairs must have equal magnitudes and opposite directions, but it doesn't tell us anything about what the magnitude of these forces actually are. Your misunderstanding likely comes from the imprecise usage of the words "action" and "reaction". In this case, these words refer to just forces, not entire processes. You can get some confusing questions if you don't understand this. For example, why is it that when I open my refrigerator that my refrigerator doesn't also open me?
answered Apr 5 at 13:23
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.7k42557
$endgroup$
Newton's third law just says when the person is hitting the floor the force the person exerts on the ground is equal to the force the ground exerts on the person. i.e. all forces are interactions.
Newton's third law does not say that all collisions are elastic, which is what you are proposing. When someone hits the floor most of the energy is absorbed by the person through deformation (as well as the floor, depending on what type of floor it is), but there is barely any rebound since people tend to not be very elastic. i.e. the deformation does not involve storing the energy to be released back into kinetic energy. Contrast this with a bouncy ball where much of the energy goes into deforming the ball, but since it is very elastic it is able to spring back and put energy back into motion. However, it is unlikely the collision is still perfectly elastic, as you seem to suggest in your question.
In summary, Newton's third law tells us that action-reaction force pairs must have equal magnitudes and opposite directions, but it doesn't tell us anything about what the magnitude of these forces actually are. Your misunderstanding likely comes from the imprecise usage of the words "action" and "reaction". In this case, these words refer to just forces, not entire processes. You can get some confusing questions if you don't understand this. For example, why is it that when I open my refrigerator that my refrigerator doesn't also open me?
answered Apr 5 at 13:23
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.7k42557
edited yesterday
answered Apr 5 at 13:23
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.7k42557
answered Apr 5 at 13:23
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.7k42557
answered Apr 5 at 13:23
Aaron StevensAaron Stevens
15.7k42557
15.7k42557
11
$begingroup$
to summarise: because human beings go splat rather than boing when hitting the ground.
$endgroup$
– jwenting
Apr 8 at 6:38
$begingroup$
now you’re talking my language :D
$endgroup$
– Ubaid Hassan
Apr 13 at 1:01
add a comment |
11
$begingroup$
to summarise: because human beings go splat rather than boing when hitting the ground.
$endgroup$
– jwenting
Apr 8 at 6:38
$begingroup$
now you’re talking my language :D
$endgroup$
– Ubaid Hassan
Apr 13 at 1:01
11
11
$begingroup$
to summarise: because human beings go splat rather than boing when hitting the ground.
$endgroup$
– jwenting
Apr 8 at 6:38
$begingroup$
to summarise: because human beings go splat rather than boing when hitting the ground.
$endgroup$
– jwenting
Apr 8 at 6:38
$begingroup$
now you’re talking my language :D
$endgroup$
– Ubaid Hassan
Apr 13 at 1:01
$begingroup$
now you’re talking my language :D
$endgroup$
– Ubaid Hassan
Apr 13 at 1:01
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When your body hits the floor, it does receive an equal and opposite reaction force from the floor. But unlike a ball a body is a complex object. So not all energy is transferred back as kinetic energy. Some energy is used to produce sound, some is used to deform your body... etc. I think you are confusing force with energy. Does every ball bounce back the same amount? Newton's 3rd law talks about force only. More force doesn't always (mostly) equal to more work done.
In your case, if all the force was used to change the body's kinetic energy somehow (which is not realistically possible), then it would have bounced back the same amount.
edited Apr 7 at 13:20
Jens
2,44611531
answered Apr 5 at 13:35
LikhonLikhon
15810
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When your body hits the floor, it does receive an equal and opposite reaction force from the floor. But unlike a ball a body is a complex object. So not all energy is transferred back as kinetic energy. Some energy is used to produce sound, some is used to deform your body... etc. I think you are confusing force with energy. Does every ball bounce back the same amount? Newton's 3rd law talks about force only. More force doesn't always (mostly) equal to more work done.
In your case, if all the force was used to change the body's kinetic energy somehow (which is not realistically possible), then it would have bounced back the same amount.
edited Apr 7 at 13:20
Jens
2,44611531
answered Apr 5 at 13:35
LikhonLikhon
15810
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
When your body hits the floor, it does receive an equal and opposite reaction force from the floor. But unlike a ball a body is a complex object. So not all energy is transferred back as kinetic energy. Some energy is used to produce sound, some is used to deform your body... etc. I think you are confusing force with energy. Does every ball bounce back the same amount? Newton's 3rd law talks about force only. More force doesn't always (mostly) equal to more work done.
In your case, if all the force was used to change the body's kinetic energy somehow (which is not realistically possible), then it would have bounced back the same amount.
edited Apr 7 at 13:20
Jens
2,44611531
answered Apr 5 at 13:35
LikhonLikhon
15810
$endgroup$
When your body hits the floor, it does receive an equal and opposite reaction force from the floor. But unlike a ball a body is a complex object. So not all energy is transferred back as kinetic energy. Some energy is used to produce sound, some is used to deform your body... etc. I think you are confusing force with energy. Does every ball bounce back the same amount? Newton's 3rd law talks about force only. More force doesn't always (mostly) equal to more work done.
In your case, if all the force was used to change the body's kinetic energy somehow (which is not realistically possible), then it would have bounced back the same amount.
edited Apr 7 at 13:20
Jens
2,44611531
answered Apr 5 at 13:35
LikhonLikhon
15810
edited Apr 7 at 13:20
Jens
2,44611531
edited Apr 7 at 13:20
Jens
2,44611531
edited Apr 7 at 13:20
Jens
2,44611531
2,44611531
answered Apr 5 at 13:35
LikhonLikhon
15810
answered Apr 5 at 13:35
LikhonLikhon
15810
answered Apr 5 at 13:35
LikhonLikhon
15810
15810
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction.
That's not a correct statement of Newton's third law.
Newton's third law of motion actually says: "If one object exerts a force on another object, then the second object also exerts a force on the first object, which is of the same magnitude but in the opposite direction."
So in this case, what Newton's third law is saying is: "If the floor pushes up on a person with a certain amount of force, then the person pushes down on the floor with the same amount of force." From this, there's no reason to think that the person would bounce back to his initial position.
answered Apr 5 at 21:39
Tanner SwettTanner Swett
1918
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
Newton defined "action" to mean "change of momentum", so that the original statement is precise, but that context is not commonly given with the quote.
$endgroup$
– aschepler
Apr 6 at 11:32
2
$begingroup$
I was being a little loose with my words. Newton wrote it correctly, but as far as I know, the word "action" isn't used that way in modern English. So I feel safe calling that phrasing incorrect.
$endgroup$
– Tanner Swett
Apr 7 at 1:31
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction.
That's not a correct statement of Newton's third law.
Newton's third law of motion actually says: "If one object exerts a force on another object, then the second object also exerts a force on the first object, which is of the same magnitude but in the opposite direction."
So in this case, what Newton's third law is saying is: "If the floor pushes up on a person with a certain amount of force, then the person pushes down on the floor with the same amount of force." From this, there's no reason to think that the person would bounce back to his initial position.
answered Apr 5 at 21:39
Tanner SwettTanner Swett
1918
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
Newton defined "action" to mean "change of momentum", so that the original statement is precise, but that context is not commonly given with the quote.
$endgroup$
– aschepler
Apr 6 at 11:32
2
$begingroup$
I was being a little loose with my words. Newton wrote it correctly, but as far as I know, the word "action" isn't used that way in modern English. So I feel safe calling that phrasing incorrect.
$endgroup$
– Tanner Swett
Apr 7 at 1:31
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction.
That's not a correct statement of Newton's third law.
Newton's third law of motion actually says: "If one object exerts a force on another object, then the second object also exerts a force on the first object, which is of the same magnitude but in the opposite direction."
So in this case, what Newton's third law is saying is: "If the floor pushes up on a person with a certain amount of force, then the person pushes down on the floor with the same amount of force." From this, there's no reason to think that the person would bounce back to his initial position.
answered Apr 5 at 21:39
Tanner SwettTanner Swett
1918
$endgroup$
If we push a person and he falls down then why doesn't he come back to its initial position. Although according to Newton's 3rd law of motion: To every action there is always equal but opposite reaction.
That's not a correct statement of Newton's third law.
Newton's third law of motion actually says: "If one object exerts a force on another object, then the second object also exerts a force on the first object, which is of the same magnitude but in the opposite direction."
So in this case, what Newton's third law is saying is: "If the floor pushes up on a person with a certain amount of force, then the person pushes down on the floor with the same amount of force." From this, there's no reason to think that the person would bounce back to his initial position.
answered Apr 5 at 21:39
Tanner SwettTanner Swett
1918
answered Apr 5 at 21:39
Tanner SwettTanner Swett
1918
answered Apr 5 at 21:39
Tanner SwettTanner Swett
1918
answered Apr 5 at 21:39
Tanner SwettTanner Swett
1918
1918
1
$begingroup$
Newton defined "action" to mean "change of momentum", so that the original statement is precise, but that context is not commonly given with the quote.
$endgroup$
– aschepler
Apr 6 at 11:32
2
$begingroup$
I was being a little loose with my words. Newton wrote it correctly, but as far as I know, the word "action" isn't used that way in modern English. So I feel safe calling that phrasing incorrect.
$endgroup$
– Tanner Swett
Apr 7 at 1:31
add a comment |
1
$begingroup$
Newton defined "action" to mean "change of momentum", so that the original statement is precise, but that context is not commonly given with the quote.
$endgroup$
– aschepler
Apr 6 at 11:32
2
$begingroup$
I was being a little loose with my words. Newton wrote it correctly, but as far as I know, the word "action" isn't used that way in modern English. So I feel safe calling that phrasing incorrect.
$endgroup$
– Tanner Swett
Apr 7 at 1:31
1
1
$begingroup$
Newton defined "action" to mean "change of momentum", so that the original statement is precise, but that context is not commonly given with the quote.
$endgroup$
– aschepler
Apr 6 at 11:32
$begingroup$
Newton defined "action" to mean "change of momentum", so that the original statement is precise, but that context is not commonly given with the quote.
$endgroup$
– aschepler
Apr 6 at 11:32
2
2
$begingroup$
I was being a little loose with my words. Newton wrote it correctly, but as far as I know, the word "action" isn't used that way in modern English. So I feel safe calling that phrasing incorrect.
$endgroup$
– Tanner Swett
Apr 7 at 1:31
$begingroup$
I was being a little loose with my words. Newton wrote it correctly, but as far as I know, the word "action" isn't used that way in modern English. So I feel safe calling that phrasing incorrect.
$endgroup$
– Tanner Swett
Apr 7 at 1:31
add a comment |
$begingroup$
It's true that on the impact the human body experiences a force upwards equal to the force the body exerts downwards on the Earth: $vecF=fracDeltavecpDelta t$. Now $Deltavecp$ doesn't send the body's momentum in the opposite direction, but instead, all the momentum change is used to crack the bones, or more general deform the body in a horrible way (unless the person jumps from a small height, in which case he or she can give his(her)self an upward force by stretching his legs in which case he can reach the same height as where he came from, or even higher; in this case though, the energy necessary to return to the same hight comes from the body, which makes it an explosive collision and here we are talking about an inelastic collision). Some parts may bounce back upwards but are pulled back again by the rest of the body. So all kinetic energy has conversed in other forms of energy (including kinetic energy $frac12mvec v^2$ in which most $vecv$'s don't have a direction upwards).
answered Apr 6 at 15:24
descheleschilderdescheleschilder
4,30921445
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
Momentum isn't used to crack bones. That's kinetic energy.
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– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:25
$begingroup$
Well, I think that's an equivalent way to say it. A change in momentum can crack bones. But I made an edit.
$endgroup$
– descheleschilder
Apr 6 at 15:28
$begingroup$
You wrote "all the momentum is used to crack the bones". You can't use up momentum like that.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:28
add a comment |
$begingroup$
It's true that on the impact the human body experiences a force upwards equal to the force the body exerts downwards on the Earth: $vecF=fracDeltavecpDelta t$. Now $Deltavecp$ doesn't send the body's momentum in the opposite direction, but instead, all the momentum change is used to crack the bones, or more general deform the body in a horrible way (unless the person jumps from a small height, in which case he or she can give his(her)self an upward force by stretching his legs in which case he can reach the same height as where he came from, or even higher; in this case though, the energy necessary to return to the same hight comes from the body, which makes it an explosive collision and here we are talking about an inelastic collision). Some parts may bounce back upwards but are pulled back again by the rest of the body. So all kinetic energy has conversed in other forms of energy (including kinetic energy $frac12mvec v^2$ in which most $vecv$'s don't have a direction upwards).
answered Apr 6 at 15:24
descheleschilderdescheleschilder
4,30921445
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
Momentum isn't used to crack bones. That's kinetic energy.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:25
$begingroup$
Well, I think that's an equivalent way to say it. A change in momentum can crack bones. But I made an edit.
$endgroup$
– descheleschilder
Apr 6 at 15:28
$begingroup$
You wrote "all the momentum is used to crack the bones". You can't use up momentum like that.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:28
add a comment |
$begingroup$
It's true that on the impact the human body experiences a force upwards equal to the force the body exerts downwards on the Earth: $vecF=fracDeltavecpDelta t$. Now $Deltavecp$ doesn't send the body's momentum in the opposite direction, but instead, all the momentum change is used to crack the bones, or more general deform the body in a horrible way (unless the person jumps from a small height, in which case he or she can give his(her)self an upward force by stretching his legs in which case he can reach the same height as where he came from, or even higher; in this case though, the energy necessary to return to the same hight comes from the body, which makes it an explosive collision and here we are talking about an inelastic collision). Some parts may bounce back upwards but are pulled back again by the rest of the body. So all kinetic energy has conversed in other forms of energy (including kinetic energy $frac12mvec v^2$ in which most $vecv$'s don't have a direction upwards).
answered Apr 6 at 15:24
descheleschilderdescheleschilder
4,30921445
$endgroup$
It's true that on the impact the human body experiences a force upwards equal to the force the body exerts downwards on the Earth: $vecF=fracDeltavecpDelta t$. Now $Deltavecp$ doesn't send the body's momentum in the opposite direction, but instead, all the momentum change is used to crack the bones, or more general deform the body in a horrible way (unless the person jumps from a small height, in which case he or she can give his(her)self an upward force by stretching his legs in which case he can reach the same height as where he came from, or even higher; in this case though, the energy necessary to return to the same hight comes from the body, which makes it an explosive collision and here we are talking about an inelastic collision). Some parts may bounce back upwards but are pulled back again by the rest of the body. So all kinetic energy has conversed in other forms of energy (including kinetic energy $frac12mvec v^2$ in which most $vecv$'s don't have a direction upwards).
answered Apr 6 at 15:24
descheleschilderdescheleschilder
4,30921445
edited Apr 6 at 15:30
answered Apr 6 at 15:24
descheleschilderdescheleschilder
4,30921445
answered Apr 6 at 15:24
descheleschilderdescheleschilder
4,30921445
answered Apr 6 at 15:24
descheleschilderdescheleschilder
4,30921445
4,30921445
1
$begingroup$
Momentum isn't used to crack bones. That's kinetic energy.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:25
$begingroup$
Well, I think that's an equivalent way to say it. A change in momentum can crack bones. But I made an edit.
$endgroup$
– descheleschilder
Apr 6 at 15:28
$begingroup$
You wrote "all the momentum is used to crack the bones". You can't use up momentum like that.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:28
add a comment |
1
$begingroup$
Momentum isn't used to crack bones. That's kinetic energy.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:25
$begingroup$
Well, I think that's an equivalent way to say it. A change in momentum can crack bones. But I made an edit.
$endgroup$
– descheleschilder
Apr 6 at 15:28
$begingroup$
You wrote "all the momentum is used to crack the bones". You can't use up momentum like that.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:28
1
1
$begingroup$
Momentum isn't used to crack bones. That's kinetic energy.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:25
$begingroup$
Momentum isn't used to crack bones. That's kinetic energy.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:25
$begingroup$
Well, I think that's an equivalent way to say it. A change in momentum can crack bones. But I made an edit.
$endgroup$
– descheleschilder
Apr 6 at 15:28
$begingroup$
Well, I think that's an equivalent way to say it. A change in momentum can crack bones. But I made an edit.
$endgroup$
– descheleschilder
Apr 6 at 15:28
$begingroup$
You wrote "all the momentum is used to crack the bones". You can't use up momentum like that.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:28
$begingroup$
You wrote "all the momentum is used to crack the bones". You can't use up momentum like that.
$endgroup$
– wizzwizz4
Apr 6 at 15:28
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Newton's third law states that when a particle applies a force on another particle then the former experiences an equal but opposite force from the other.When a ball hits the ground it comes back due to the fact that it experiences an elastic collsion(that is does not undergo any deformation).Think about a fur ball,will it come back,obviously no,why is that so?This is because when a fur ball collides with the ground(assuming a concrete ground)it undergoes deformation (due to the reaction force from the ground) and the kinetic energy of the ball is used up in deforming the ball.Same is the case for a human being who undergoes deformation on hitting the ground and hence does not come back to it's initial position.
answered Apr 7 at 15:34
SagnikSagnik
695
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Newton's third law states that when a particle applies a force on another particle then the former experiences an equal but opposite force from the other.When a ball hits the ground it comes back due to the fact that it experiences an elastic collsion(that is does not undergo any deformation).Think about a fur ball,will it come back,obviously no,why is that so?This is because when a fur ball collides with the ground(assuming a concrete ground)it undergoes deformation (due to the reaction force from the ground) and the kinetic energy of the ball is used up in deforming the ball.Same is the case for a human being who undergoes deformation on hitting the ground and hence does not come back to it's initial position.
answered Apr 7 at 15:34
SagnikSagnik
695
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Newton's third law states that when a particle applies a force on another particle then the former experiences an equal but opposite force from the other.When a ball hits the ground it comes back due to the fact that it experiences an elastic collsion(that is does not undergo any deformation).Think about a fur ball,will it come back,obviously no,why is that so?This is because when a fur ball collides with the ground(assuming a concrete ground)it undergoes deformation (due to the reaction force from the ground) and the kinetic energy of the ball is used up in deforming the ball.Same is the case for a human being who undergoes deformation on hitting the ground and hence does not come back to it's initial position.
answered Apr 7 at 15:34
SagnikSagnik
695
$endgroup$
Newton's third law states that when a particle applies a force on another particle then the former experiences an equal but opposite force from the other.When a ball hits the ground it comes back due to the fact that it experiences an elastic collsion(that is does not undergo any deformation).Think about a fur ball,will it come back,obviously no,why is that so?This is because when a fur ball collides with the ground(assuming a concrete ground)it undergoes deformation (due to the reaction force from the ground) and the kinetic energy of the ball is used up in deforming the ball.Same is the case for a human being who undergoes deformation on hitting the ground and hence does not come back to it's initial position.
answered Apr 7 at 15:34
SagnikSagnik
695
answered Apr 7 at 15:34
SagnikSagnik
695
answered Apr 7 at 15:34
SagnikSagnik
695
answered Apr 7 at 15:34
SagnikSagnik
695
695
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Energy is not lost, but it is expended in different ways when different objects collide.
A more visceral statement of these principles:
Drop a rubber ball on the floor. As it hits the floor it stores up spring energy inside itself, and then bounces back almost as high as the start point, losing only a little energy to friction.
Drop a hard billiard ball on the floor. It bounces a bit, but much of the energy gets spent making a dent in the floor.
Drop a sphere of soft clay on the floor. It goes "splat" - most of the energy is spent pushing the clay out sideways. (There may be a small crown on the blob of clay on the floor where some of it did bounce back a bit.)
Drop a human being on the floor. Where does the energy go? It goes into bruising skin and muscles, bouncing internal organs back and forth, forcing air out of the person's lungs, swear words, etc. It takes quite a forceful impact to have enough leftover energy yo make a human being bounce enough to see.
The concept of a spherical cow is often used to describe the way real-world objects are simplified to make the underlying physics easier to describe; in this case you seem to be thinking of a spherical person.
answered Apr 7 at 21:28
arparp
1012
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Energy is not lost, but it is expended in different ways when different objects collide.
A more visceral statement of these principles:
Drop a rubber ball on the floor. As it hits the floor it stores up spring energy inside itself, and then bounces back almost as high as the start point, losing only a little energy to friction.
Drop a hard billiard ball on the floor. It bounces a bit, but much of the energy gets spent making a dent in the floor.
Drop a sphere of soft clay on the floor. It goes "splat" - most of the energy is spent pushing the clay out sideways. (There may be a small crown on the blob of clay on the floor where some of it did bounce back a bit.)
Drop a human being on the floor. Where does the energy go? It goes into bruising skin and muscles, bouncing internal organs back and forth, forcing air out of the person's lungs, swear words, etc. It takes quite a forceful impact to have enough leftover energy yo make a human being bounce enough to see.
The concept of a spherical cow is often used to describe the way real-world objects are simplified to make the underlying physics easier to describe; in this case you seem to be thinking of a spherical person.
answered Apr 7 at 21:28
arparp
1012
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Energy is not lost, but it is expended in different ways when different objects collide.
A more visceral statement of these principles:
Drop a rubber ball on the floor. As it hits the floor it stores up spring energy inside itself, and then bounces back almost as high as the start point, losing only a little energy to friction.
Drop a hard billiard ball on the floor. It bounces a bit, but much of the energy gets spent making a dent in the floor.
Drop a sphere of soft clay on the floor. It goes "splat" - most of the energy is spent pushing the clay out sideways. (There may be a small crown on the blob of clay on the floor where some of it did bounce back a bit.)
Drop a human being on the floor. Where does the energy go? It goes into bruising skin and muscles, bouncing internal organs back and forth, forcing air out of the person's lungs, swear words, etc. It takes quite a forceful impact to have enough leftover energy yo make a human being bounce enough to see.
The concept of a spherical cow is often used to describe the way real-world objects are simplified to make the underlying physics easier to describe; in this case you seem to be thinking of a spherical person.
answered Apr 7 at 21:28
arparp
1012
$endgroup$
Energy is not lost, but it is expended in different ways when different objects collide.
A more visceral statement of these principles:
Drop a rubber ball on the floor. As it hits the floor it stores up spring energy inside itself, and then bounces back almost as high as the start point, losing only a little energy to friction.
Drop a hard billiard ball on the floor. It bounces a bit, but much of the energy gets spent making a dent in the floor.
Drop a sphere of soft clay on the floor. It goes "splat" - most of the energy is spent pushing the clay out sideways. (There may be a small crown on the blob of clay on the floor where some of it did bounce back a bit.)
Drop a human being on the floor. Where does the energy go? It goes into bruising skin and muscles, bouncing internal organs back and forth, forcing air out of the person's lungs, swear words, etc. It takes quite a forceful impact to have enough leftover energy yo make a human being bounce enough to see.
The concept of a spherical cow is often used to describe the way real-world objects are simplified to make the underlying physics easier to describe; in this case you seem to be thinking of a spherical person.
answered Apr 7 at 21:28
arparp
1012
answered Apr 7 at 21:28
arparp
1012
answered Apr 7 at 21:28
arparp
1012
answered Apr 7 at 21:28
arparp
1012
1012
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Related: physics.stackexchange.com/q/45653/2451 and links therein.
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– Qmechanic♦
Apr 5 at 13:54
1
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Related question
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– Aaron Stevens
Apr 7 at 22:06
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If you used a trampoline instead of, say, concrete, then you get the bounce. The trampoline can store the required energy. Concrete not so much.
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– chasly from UK
Apr 8 at 10:08
1
$begingroup$
Newton's third law does not say that what goes up must come down (or any variation on this). It does not in any way say that if some specific thing happens, then afterwards this other thing happens. It's a very common misconception, though.
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– Arthur
Apr 8 at 13:42
2
$begingroup$
I don't see why this question was closed. It seems pretty straightforward to me.
$endgroup$
– Aaron Stevens
Apr 20 at 15:51